जिगु अन्तर्वार्ता ः नःलि ः दँ ८, ल्याः ६ ः नेसं ११३३ चौला

• xfno\ l5u' lgofqf ;km" ‘Gofld;fof b];o\’ t;s+ rlr{t h'n uHofu' cg'ej b' <

Hjhnkf . oSj ;'efo\ . lhu' lgofqf ;k"m æGofld;fof b];o\Æ t;s+ nf 5' rlr{t x] hs h'n wsfM wfo] nf dlhplg . t/ u'ln:of+ Ajg, pld;+ oo]sflbOu' b' . lh no\tfM, lhu' Gxfkf+u' g]kfnefiff ;k"moft Ajgflapu'ln+ .

• l5u' ;flxTo n]vgof Oltxf; u'sy+ b' <

y'lsoft Oltxf; x] wsfM nf dwfo], aMrfxfsMu' cg'ej b' . Gxfkf gsltlg /Tg /fHonIdL SofDk;o\ cfOP Ajgfano\ ;'s'Gbf bFkltO 5k' lrafv+ laofu', $@ ;fn kfv] h'O . yMu' gf+ GXoyg] d5fnfM /f dfgGw/ wsfM gf+ tofM . jof+ lnkf cHofMu' SofDk;of yL yL bFkltO afv+ j Wofr"RjvFt RjofM laof . u'u'+ lkxfF jO, u'u'+ lkxfF jOdv' . oSj wofy]+ nf klqsf x] lkbgLdv' . lnkf ;GWof 6fOD;o\] Rjo]u' ofgf . Gxfkf ;d;fdlos Jo+Uo cn] lnkf oSj ljrf/k|wfg n]v hs, plsoft ;flxTo wfo]u' nfls dwfo]u', j Ajldlkgu' vF .

Gxfkf+lg;]+ ;flxToo\ ?lr b';f+ ;flxTo x] wsfM nf oSj snd dGXofsf . lh+ ;flxTo Rjo] kmOdv'y]+ tfOu' yMt . Rj x] dRjofu' wfM;f dv' .

hflu/] kqsfl/tfoft ltnf~hnL laOj+ xfg+ yMt 3';'xF' ;flxTokfv £jfgf . k'nf+kfnf+u' Rjoftofu' kf08'lnlkoft ;k"mof ?k laof . Gxfkf+ nf ;g\ @))^no\ d'lQmgfy ofqfoft sofM Rjoftofu' P:k]/fGtf] efo\of lgofqfoft ;k"mof ?k laof . cg+ oSj GXoM tof/ ofgftofu' g]kfnL–P:k]/fGtf] zAbsf]z g+ lkxfF jn . @))&o\ hfkfg jgfu' lgofqf lhld efiff;Dkfbsln;] j}rfl/s dtleGgtf jo]j+ w'n+ uofRjg . cn] larfM jn, g]kfnefiff+ x] lgofqf 5fo\ dRjo] < oSj:of+ Yj ljwf gfnfsfMu' dvgfM lh g+ Rjo]nf dRjo]nf h'ofRj+u' vM . Yj x] ‰jno\ 5k' lgk' tMxfsMu' lgofqf Rjo]w'+sfM lh+ ;k"mof ?ko\ æGofld;fof b];o\Æ lktlaOu' cfF6 ofgf . ps'Gx' ltlg lhu' g]kfMof nf]safv+of ;k"m P:k]/fGtf] ef;+ hfkfg+ lkbg .

d]u' 5u" lgofqf ;k"mof kf08'lnlk nueu tof/ b' . k|sfzs n't wfM;f y'u'l;O xfg+ 5u" ;k"m lkbgL . ;km" lksfo]u' u'ln yfs' wOu' cg'ej b' . t/ u'ln kmO :jo], Rjof+ Rjg] — GofOlk+ db', AjgLlk+ db', ;dfnf]rs+ ;dfnf]rgf ofgfdlap wsfM Rjo]u' wfM;f cfM yy]+ lbs]dv' . ;'oft+ no\tfo]s]t dv', ;'+ t+rfowsfM UofgfMdv', yDx+ v+u' yMu' g'uMof ef;+ Rjo]dfM wOu' lhu' larfM .

a? Ajg] wfM;f l;Ss oM lh . g]kfnefiff, g]kfnL, lxGbL, c+u|]hL lg;+ uan]+ uan]+ P:k]/fGtf] efo\ of ;flxTo ts+ n'Oj+, nfo]j+ Ajg]u' dTjMtf . d]lklgu' ;flxTo Ajg]ano\ yMDx:of+ g+ af+nfs Rjo]u' phf{ k|fKt h'O . pls;+ lh yf}+ sGxo\ af}4 wd{ AjgfRjgf .

• l5tM uHofu' ;flxTo ljwf+ cfslif{t ofM <

Ajg]t nf lh+ bSj sy+of ;flxlTos ljwf Ajgf . sljtf, afv+, pkGof;, gf6s g+ . pls;+ yM, yMu' ljrfMln;] kf7soft ;xefuL ofs] bOu' lgaGw ljwf+ lhtM oSj cfslif{t ofM . em\oft'u' bfz{lgs jf 1fg laOu' dv', yMu' efjln;] Ajldoft nfn sfo]sLu' lghfTds lgaGw oM lhtM . jof+lnkf pkGof; h'O .

Gxfkf :s"no\ ano\lg;]+ ofqf;flxTokfv]+ lh t;s+ k|efljt . :s"no\ 5k' lgofqf g]kfnLO Ajgfu' n'd+ . cano\ j :jofM oSj ofqf;flxToln;] kl/lrt h'O dvg . lnkf drfo]s lh u'lne;{ 6«feN;+ lhtM cfsif{0f ofgfRjg . zfob c+u|]hL PdP Ajgfano\ ltlg l;n lh+ j nf k|tLsfTds ofqf hs vM wsfM . y'sy+ lh ofqf;flxTo ln;] Kok'gfjg .

lnkf g]kfnLof lgofqfsf/ eLid pk|]tLln;] JolQmut :jfk" bo]j+ Yj ljwfoft b'Uo+s y'Os] vg . k|]/0ffy]+ h'n . g]kfnL lgofqft Ajgfo+sf dft"dfnfM . pls+ lhtM :ogf g+ lan, yMu' ljifooft uy]ofgfM GXoAjo]wu' wsfM . yg ofqfo\ ljj/0fof km}nfj6 j efjof ulx/fOof ;Gt'ngk"0f{ j0f{g bO — n]vs+ lhtM rfMlxOsL, dltgf ofgfM yMu' g'uM vF sgL . n]vsof efjgf j yMu' efjgf Psfsf/ h"jgL . ;jfM y"ln;] lh em+ em+ y'lsO b'gfjg .

• lgofqf n]vg g]kfnefiffo\ pln rlNtof lawf dv' wfOlg <

c+u|]hLof nf 5' vF Nxfo], g]kfnL ts+ Yj bsno\ rlNtof ljwf wfo]dfM . t/ emL g]kfnefiffo\ wfM;f y'ls+ ;flxToof lj:s+ ljwfof ?ko\ :yflkt ts+ h'O dk'mlg .

VjLbFof b'g] g]kfnefiffo\ lgofqf wfo]NjMu' 5u" bh{g ;k"m lkdbg]u' wOu' no\tfo]l5+u' vF dv', emLu' ;flxTo cg Yo+ yg Yo+ wsfM xfnfh'Olk+ emLu' lg+lt+ . cy]nf g]kfnefiffo\ u'u' ljwfoft rlNtu' wfo]u' wOu' d]u' GXo;M emLu' GXoMg] blg .

• l5u' g]kfnefiff ;flxToof cWoogkfv] u'lnt ?rL b' < u'ln cWoog ofgflbofu' b' <

:s"no\ P]lR5s g]kfnefiff sofM Ajgfano\lg;]+ g]kfnefiff ;flxToof ;jfM sfo]u' jftfj/0f tof/ h'n . SofDk;o\ c+u|]hL sofM Ajgf;f+ lh g]kfnefiff softMlk+ kf;flk+ln;] ;ltO . cg ;'s'Gbf ;flxTo kfMnfMof lh Gjs" h'of, 5wfM Kofv+ w]+w]+aNnfMsf;f;fo\ g+ Ajlt sof . k'nf+Dx kf;f ;'/]z dfgGw/of ;+ut+ a'n'x'F g]kfnefiff ;flxTo j cfGbf]ngoft Dxl;sf o+sf .

!((^;fno\ c+u|]hL PdP l;wo]sfM xfg+ g]kfnefiffof dltgf+ ;fn . lh+ !((&;fno\ g]kfnefiffo\ PdP Ajgf . Gxfkf g]kfnefiff ;flxTo o;]+ hs Ajg]u', cg nf plsof lj:t[t cWoog x] h'n . yMt g]kfnefiff ;flxToo\ XjAjfs]t a'n'x'F tof/ ofgf .

lhtM n'd+, ljwfut ?k+ wfo]u' vM;f lhtM O{Zj/fgGbof pkGof; on, cn] d+unk|;fb j kß/Tgof lgaGw . sljtf g+ oSj x] oMu' vM t/ can] sf];{o\ wsfM Ajgflk+ sljlklgu' k|efjzfnL sljtf Ajg]w'+sfM pldu' x] Gx" Gx"u' sljtf Ajg]ano\ ˆof;';] Rjgfj+u'of sf/0f dfnfRjg]u' . 8f= sdn k|sfz dNn j dfl0fsnfnof ;dfnf]rgfkfv]+ lh t;s+ k|efljt h'Ou' . lh g+ lnkf ;dfnf]rs h'O nf wofy]+ dltO jOu' .

• ;flxTo n]vg :jof+ GXoM l5 kqsfl/tfo Vono\ cKjM ;lqmo h'of lbO, kqsfl/tfkfv] l5u' uHofu' cg"ej b' <

kqsfl/tf lhu' k]zf vM . PdP l;wo]j+ !((^ ;fno\ lb sf7df08" kf]:6o\ l/kf]6{/ sy+ hflu/ gof . cg+ @))@no\ lb lxdfnog 6fOD;o\ Yog . ofo]dfMu' Hofofln;]+ g]jfM ;+:s[lt j ;Dkbfof vF Rjo] vgls lh no\tfOu', clkm;o\ lhtM g]jfMto\ kqsf/ wsfM Wofr' gs";f+ . Hofof x'nd'no\ g+ g]kfnefiff+ Rjo]u' dTjMtf . !((^ lg;]+ @))* ts kqsfl/tfof hflu/+ oSj Rjsn, ;flxlTos :jofM g+ ;d;fdlos, ;dfrf/ VjfM jMu' . ;flxTokfv]+ lh tfkfgf x] Rjg]dfn . On+ nfsfM ;GWof 6fOD;o\ /f dfgGw/ wOu' Rj;fgfd+ g+ yMu' ljrf/t laof x] Rjgf .

g]kfno\ ug+ l;/kfM sfo]dg+;f+ l;+ufk'/+ lkbgLu' 5u" klqsfo\ lkb+u' lhu' n]voft hfkfgof Pl8lacfO g+ ofMu' k|ltof]lutfo\ b'ltgfM 5u" cGt/f{li6«o l;/kfM wfM;f sfo]vg . !@bF ts tkfMu' b}lgs cvaf/o\ Hof ofo]w'+sfM a'n'xF' erf Rjo\ Yog]j+ Yj ttMw+u' klqsfo\ xflsdof OR5f sy+ RjRj+ yM :jtGq h'OvgLdv' wOu' rfofjn . rf+lGx+ s/lkG;+ wfMy] s/lklgu' vF hs RjofM yMt 5\on]u' :jofM kl/jf/oft O{ laofM j yM oMu' Hof ofgfM Djfo]dfl:t jn . @))*o\ b}lgs cvaf/L kqsfl/tfof hflu/ TjMtflaof .

• g]kfnefiffof kqsfl/tf l5u' ;+nUgtf Ono\ Aono\ Gog] b' t/ lg/Gt/tf db' < 5fo\ y]+ <

g]kfnefiff kqsfl/tfof Vono\ lhu' lg/Gt/tf nf 5' ;+nUgtf x] db' wfM;f+ lhp . Gxfkf+lg;+ nfMnfMano\ dltO n"u' larfM ;GWof 6fOD;oft laofRjgf . j x] nf kqsfl/tf dv' . lhu' larf/+ g]jfM ;dfhoft kl/jt{g nf ofo]dkm't, j}rfl/s c;xdlt h"u' sf/0f+ kmf]g+ kmf]g+ wDsL wfM;f 5sM lgsM kmo]dfn . Yj x] lhu' nflu l;/kfM vM .

a? @)!) kfv] ono\of kf;flk+ln;] æg]jfMkf}Æ gfd+ 5u" klqsf ;Dkfbg ofgf . y'ls+ lgoldt ?k sfo] dnfo]s+ x] lbgfRjg]dfn . sf/0f bSj:of+ l;p — ofgfu' b' wsfM hs wfo]of lg+lt+ ofgfRjg]u'of vf; cy{ b' dtfo]sf .

a? g]kfnefiff kqsfl/tfof af/] erf–erf cWoog b' wfo]dfM . g]kfnefiff PdP Ajgfano\ y]l;; Rjo]sy+ lh+ g]kfnefiff 5fkf kqsfl/tfof cWoog ofgfu' . cfM nf oSj:of+ Rjo]w'+sn . cano\ nf ;k"mof ?ko\ eujtL k|;fb+ RjoftMu' g]kfnefiff kqklqsfof hftM afx]s g]kfnefiff kqsfl/tfof Dx;Lsf laOu' 5'+ ;k"m x] db'lg . pln cWoog ofo]w'+sfM g]kfnefiffo\ plndl5 kqklqsf 5fo\ lkbgL 5fo\ lbO wOu' y'n wfo]dfM .

• g]kfnefiffof plndl5 klqsf lkbgfRj+u' b' t/ Ajldto\ sdL b', sf/0f 5' h'O <

g]kfnefiff kqsfl/tfo\ RjOlk+ db', AjgLlk+ db', GofgfM AjgLlk+ nf emg\ x] db' . Yj emL bSj:of+ vgfRjgf . g]jfMt pln lzlIft, cn] /fhwfgL yHofMu' yf;o\ Rjg]vgfRj+u' b' . cy];f+ yMu' c:tLTj x] d]lkGt Sog]u' g]kfnefiff+ lkxfFjMu' kqklqsf Ajg]u' afgL db' . g]jfMto\ vo\ efo\ c+u|]hL jf lxGbL efo\of kqklqsf Ajg]oM, g]jfM efo\of kqklqsf Ajg] doM . sf/0f lh+ 5' wfo] kmO< lh+ g+ Yj x] GogfRjg]u' . emLs] df+efo\of dltgf db'u' vMnf, jf dltgf b' wsfM Sog]t hs dltgfof :jf+ 5ˆjM sf]6o\ :jrfs]y]+ hs vMnf, j lh+ wfo] dk'm . dltgf b"u' vM;f emLu' efo\of klqsf ;'+ vo\, ad'{ jofM DjfsflaOu' dv;]+ln GofgfM Ajg]u', ltaM laOu' emLu' x] bfoLTj vM wsfM ts nf jfMrfo]sflaOdfMu' vM y]+ Rj+ . xfg+ emL bSj kqklqsf Joj;flos 9+u+ :jofM efiff;]jf ofo]y]+ hs lkyg]dfMu'ln+ jf lkbgfRj+u'ln+ g+ y'ls+ :t/Lotfoft yMu' nIo bo]s]dk'mu' cn] Yj x] sf/0f+ AjldlkGt ;fn]dk'mu' vMnf wofy]+ g+ lhtM tfM .

• jt{dfg g]kfnefiff ;flxToof ultlalwaf/] u'lnt ;Gt'i6 h'oflbof <

g]kfnefiff ;flxToof ultlalwaf/] ;Gt'i6 h'Ot Gxfkf+ nf ultljlw h'Odfn lg . lh+ nf ultljlw x] g åno\ :joo\ 5sM lgsM h'Ou' vgf . j g+ GXofan]+ GXofyf;+ j x] VjfMkfM, j x] vF . !# nfv g]jfMt b' wofRjgf emL;+ . t/ g]kfnefiff ;flxToof ultljlw wfM;f j x] %)–!))Dxl;ofu' hs k]jf, lhDd]jf/L h'ofRjg . Gx"lk+ dg"t b'tdsofu' nf b'xfF djMu' nf .

k'nf+u' bSj ;flxlTos vnMk'rMt GXon+AjfgfRjg, ;flxlTos kqklqsft tgfjg]w'+sn . emL 5vf 5]Fo\ Ejo\ 5sM GofM;f ål5 dg" d'gL, emLDx gLDx Hof;gf k'rM b"u' ;+:yf+ ;flxlTos Hofem\jM GXofs";f ;l5 dg"t d'g] yfs' . pls;+ oSj wofy]+ ;flxlTos vnM k'rM /fhgLlts kf6L{of srf h'ofRj+u' b' . cg kf6L{of ef;+ sljtf, afv+ RjO, AjldlkGt sfo{stf{y]+ tfo]sL .

;k"m lksfgfof nf vF x] d]u' blg . 5Dx cf};t g]jfM n]vsof 5u" ;k"m Gof;MkfM lkb+;f lnt"lngfM ldp;f+ ;l5kfM r'Os] yfs' . cHofMu' ;k"m x] g+ bl5of lemu" gLu' :jofM oSj lkbgfRj+u' cj:yf db' . xfg+ ;dfnf]rslk+ ug b', pld;+ cfMof ;flxlTos ultljlwoft u'sy+ ljZn]if0f ofO wsfM dfMjg] dflg . ;'gf+ nfkf yfO, ;'gf+ Gxfo\s+ SogL< y'lsoft g+ ultljlw wfo]u' nf < Yj :jofM ;Gt'i6 h'Ou' nf<

• g]kfnefiffof ;flxTo n]vgo\ Gxfkf u'ln :t/ b' cfMof n]vg pln :t/Lo dh" wofu' Gog]b', cy] vM nf <

Gxfkfofu' wsfM uano\oft wfo]u' wOu' x] GXo;M vM . Gxfkfofu' vF u'ln Nxfo]u' . lh ;dfnf]rs nf dv', cy];f+ !(()of /fhgLlts kl/jt{g lnkfof v'Nnf jftfj/0f j;f+lg;]+ g]kfnefiff ;flxTo ;+VofTds j u'0ffTds lgsy+ x] :t/Lo dh'n y]+ lhtM tfM . Gxfkfoflk+ af+nfMlk+ RjldlkG;+ cfM dRjo]w'+sn, ;k"m lkdyg]w'+sn . xfg+ pld;+ Gx"u' 5'+ Rj x] Rjn wfM;f+ plsO Gxfkfof lt ;jfM dbOano\ g'uM Sjt'gLu' :jefljs vM . cHofMlk+ n]vs ;flxTosf/lkG;+ yMt Gxfkf:jofM kl/dflh{t ofo]u' nf ug k'nf+u' Od]h hs No+sfto]km';f+ af+nfMy]+ tfof .

;sf/fTds h'OdfM wOu' nf b' t/ g]kfnefiffof :t/ emL;+ hs b' wof+ dlhp, emLu' efo\of ;flxTooft d]u' ef;+ lxnfM pldt Aj+sfM pldu' k|ltlqmof sfo]dfM y]+ Rj+ .

• g]kfnefiff ;flxTo ljsf;of lg+lt+ cfM u'hf]u' ultlalwof cfjZostf tfo]sf lbof <

5' ofo]dfM wsfM emL bSj:of+ l;p . TjfMTjfno\ ;flxToof ultljlw, ;Dd]ng, uf]i7Lt GXofo]dfn, k'nf+lk+ GXoMjo]sfRj+lk+ n]vslkG;+ GXon+ rfo]s]dfn, Gx"Gx"lk+ n]vslkG;+ snd GXofs]dfn . j ln;]+ ;flxTo+ /fhgLlts kf6L{of efo\ Nxfo]u' TjMt]dfn, hgtfof ef;+ l;h{gf h'Odfn . g]kfnefiff ;flxTooft lg/Gt/ dltgf ofOu' ;lqmo ;+:yf dfn . u'lnv] ;flxTosf/lklg :jcWoogof cefj vgfRjgf . yMu' efo\of yM kf;flkG;+ RjoftMu' x] Ajg]u' afgL oSjl;of db', vo\ efo\of ;flxToof cWoog hs ofM;f+ yf}sGxo\ ;flxTo u'v] jgfRjg wOu' l;ObO . cn] yMyjo\ gfknfo]u', ;flxTooft sofM rrf{kl/rf{ ofo]u', j+ joft j+joft :og]u', af+nfM af+dnfM /fo laOu' ofo]dfn . pls;+ emLu' ;flxToo\ lg/Gt/ snd GXofMlk++ ;dfnf]rsto\;+ Gx"lk+ j k'nf+lk+ Rjldlklgu' s[ltof ;dfnf]rgf ofo]u' kl/kf6L xfg+ Ajng wfM;f emLu' ;flxTo+ Gx"u' ;'y :jo]vgL wOu' ljZjf; b' .

lhu' cGtjf{tf{ M gMln M bF *, NofM ^ M g];+ !!## rf}nf